Second Chance Horse Rescue Discussion Boards

Muso · Joined: 09 Mar 2008 Posts: 630

Ok, here's how it works...

* A picture of a horse is posted at the beginning of the thread.
* Each poster has to post one (only) comment about that horse's conformation, desirable or not. Anything at all, as long as it's specific (ie "this horse appears to have very upright pasterns" not "this horse has terrible feet" - must be specific).
* You can agree or disagree with any comments, and general discussion is welcome. If possible, explain how this conformational feature may be advantageous or disadvantageous to the horse.
* Don't be shy - this is an educational thread for both readers and participants, and is a great way to learn about conformation. Smile

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Here's the picture (SC's Eclipse)

Muso · Joined: 09 Mar 2008 Posts: 630

Nice short back with sloping croup. Increases athleticism.

Edited to add: does anyone know if a back can be too short?
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SecondChance · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 8:19 am Post subject:

He has a really nice shoulder angle, means he would have pretty good scope over fences! He's also be a comfortable ride with a nice length of stride.
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Kimaley · Joined: 05 Apr 2007 Posts: 423 Location: Roleystone

Ok the 'judge' is coming out in me here Razz

For me he is a little short and thick in the neck and gullet. This can create difficulty in creating a true 'round' frame. It is also a VERY common trait in the Standardbred!
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shadowkat · Joined: 21 Feb 2009 Posts: 127 Location: perth, wa

This IS an educational thread - I know bugger all about conformation, just whether or not I like the look of a horse.
To my extremely uneducated eye, his shoulders look a bit too vertical - all up he seems a bit boxy. But I'm happy to be told otherwise, especially if everything is explained in detail.
Keep it all coming!

SecondChance · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:07 pm Post subject:

Absolutely Shadowkat however when looking at horses for potential as jumpers you want a good shoulder ANGLE, the slope isn't such a concern. A good angle means the horse can much more easily tuck its front legs up nicely when jumping.
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shadowkat · Joined: 21 Feb 2009 Posts: 127 Location: perth, wa

Ok - which bit are we calculating the angle from? Confused

SecondChance · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:12 pm Post subject:

To answer your Q Muso I think backs can be too short. A short back is generally good for performance, making it easier to execute tight turns and things so for a good jumper, cutting horse, polo horse etc you want a short back... but when they are very short (measures less than 1 3rd of the overall body length) they tend to be very rigid and uncomfortable to ride, lack flexibility and become stiff.

If vertebral spines of back are excessively small, the horse may have difficulty bending and later develop spinal arthritis. This adversely affects dressage and jumping performance. If still in back and torso, the stride will become stiff and inelastic. The horse may overreach, forge, or scalp itself if the hind legs do not move straight.
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SecondChance · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:24 pm Post subject:

OK here's the same photo with the angles accounted for...

You can see the shoulder angle where the scapula (long shoulder bone) joins the humerus (short shoulder bone going down to leg) is a 90degree angle. That isn't a bad angle for a jumper so I have been told. Definately could be better but we're not dealing with grand prix horses here.

The more upright shoulder slope is common for Standardbreds too, because they're bred for quick bursts of speed rather than ridden disciplines.

Overall Eclipse's conformation is excellent for a nice little all round riding and low level competition horse. If you wanted a really good jumper, for medium to high levels, you'd want something with a longer humus and a little more slope in the scapula.

From his other photos you can see his front legs are reasonably straight, but he is quite toed out behind, in general he is neat and tidy and compact.

If we're really going to pick things apart, he has sickle hocks which limits the straightening of his hindlegs (see how the cannon slopes inwards and isn't straight up and down?) this will in turn limit his power for pushing off and propulsion. Can also affect speed which may explain why he most likely didn't make it on the track.
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princesssparkles · Joined: 18 Oct 2009 Posts: 1

i think youve covered everything!!! for western we like a 45 degree slop of the shoulder,
but he is quite balanced (proportionate shoulder, barrel and rump etc), could tie a bit neater at the base of his neck, and yes he is turned out behind and sickle hocked

ozbatt · Second Chance Mod Joined: 27 Aug 2008 Posts: 713

I would have thought that rather than being sickle hocked, he's standing like that because his hind toes are too long. The actual angle of the hock doesn't seem particularly acute.

Muso · Joined: 09 Mar 2008 Posts: 630

Good point Ozbatt - now that you mention it (sickle hocked) I tend to think the same.

What about the tail - low set or normal?

Also about the back area, he does have good depth which indicates decent abdominal muscles, needed for strength and engagement. Interestingly, it's supposed to be common in the Morgan breed, which is one of the founding breeds of the STB isn't it?
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Sugar's Mum · Joined: 04 Jul 2009 Posts: 82 Location: Busselton

I think he has long cannon bones which means high impact sports would have a tendency to cause leg problems. So I wouldn't be inclined to jump him over high jumps.
I als think his shoulder is very upright making for a hard choppy stride. If there was more slope on the line of the shoulder he would be more bouncy and less jarring in movement.
I think his tail is low set but he may be clamping it down being in an unfamiliar place. It would be interesting to see him in a few weeks time when he is more relaxed.

painter · Joined: 24 Nov 2008 Posts: 116 Location: Roleystone

I'd like to see him standing on concrete, this just could be an awkward stance caught on camera, but he dosn't look comfortable on his feet to me. His near hind hoof looks too high in the heel, if he is high heeled (possibly contracted?) and long in the toe, this is going to affect his legs and hocks, or at least make him look like he has conformational faults when he dosn't.

He looks quite short and thick in the neck as well. Also looks tight in the sacro-iliac region so I would love to see the difference after a chiro adjustment.
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